Space, The Final Frontier

mtskull · Post by **mtskull** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 11:18 am

Renegadenemo wrote: I think we ought to learn to live down here and manage our little planet before we start messing about up there.

Have to agree with you entirely there, Bill.

Renegadenemo · Post by **Renegadenemo** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 3:02 pm

I do take an interest in space exploration but as someone mentioned diving I can't help feeling that there's a serious parallel. Those intent on going to the bottom of the ocean have realised that a man in a rubber suit is limited by his millennia-old physiology to about 100m of water - a bit more in saturation diving but we're stuck with the way our bodies are made and how they work. We can get to full ocean depth in manned submersibles but what's the point when you can send a ROV down and get more work out of it with no risk to life or limb?
This whizzing up for a look at the earth and a float about in zero-g is the astronautical equivalent of a dip with the coloured fishes on the Barrier Reef and that's fine - but shouldn't the people who want to get to Mars make a better ROV and leave it at that? What's the use of going there?

f1steveuk · Post by **f1steveuk** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 7:44 pm

There you go, diving, aviation and spaceflight, all in one!!

http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index. ... ic=19613.0

Renegadenemo · Post by **Renegadenemo** » Fri Jul 15, 2011 12:35 am

I like it - they'd never have dared do anything so daft in my diving days though. It'd have been a toss up between whether we cut the anchor off first and then sank the plane in deeper water or just cut the buoy off and let the plane crash into the bottom with one of us laughing hysterically at the controls.
This anarchic behaviour, and its potential future impact on the wreck site, was one of the arguments put forward for the recovery of K7 but only the divers got it. The nay-sayers and museologists, tucked up in their wicker chairs reading the Guardian, thought this the thinnest of excuses but we really were that crazy.

Pullman99 · Post by **Pullman99** » Thu Jul 21, 2011 12:22 pm

Mike Bull wrote:Well, that's that then.

Indeed. So,what other transport related (in the widest context) vehicles - apart from K7's retrun - that can truly inspire and that we can still experience as they were meant to be have we to look forward to?

In preservation there are quite a few of course. The railway world has its Tornado and The Unknown Warrior projects as well as some superb restorations. In aviation there is XH558 and whatever happened to the idea to return an Air France Concorde to the skies? Motorsport has all sorts of historic competition cars and example being the re-appearance of the Jaguar "low drag coupe" earlier this year was a particular highlight. For road transport, a highlight for me this year was seeing the relica of Cugnot's Fardier in action. On the water, the SS United States Conservancy has finally secured the funding to ensure the preservation of one of the most famous ships in the world (a shame that the Canberra or the Barrow built Oriana couldn't have been saved for Britain).

But it is in the regular, everyday transport scene that there is now a definitely poorer and possibly less inspired, scene that having objects like a Concorde or a Space Shuttle at the top of the pyramid could - until today - provide the feeling that there is a continual progresion to ever greater achievements. In Brtain, somehow the drive of the "New Elizabethan Age" - of which Bluebird K7 and CN7 were very much a part - has diminished as a result. So, where is the next "big thing" coming from? Answers on a postcard....

quicksilver-wsr · Post by **quicksilver-wsr** » Thu Jul 21, 2011 12:35 pm

Just glad Atlantis got back safely ...

Don't want to lose any more Orbiters or crews.

malcolm uk · Post by **malcolm uk** » Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:48 pm

So, where is the next "big thing" coming from? Answers on a postcard....

Well not a postcard ................... but what about the British backed space flights - Virgin Galactic or Richard's underwater explorer to get to depths of the Oceans which have not been explored by Man (or Woman)?

Malcolm

Stuart Baker · Post by **Stuart Baker** » Thu Jul 21, 2011 10:30 pm

Ian,

and whatever happened to the idea to retrun an Air France Concorde to the skies?

I, for one, was very sad to see Concorde retire - especially after such a short return to flight after the accident. However, I think the chances of it flying again are less than me winning last week's lottery (for which I didn't buy a ticket).

It took around £8m to put XH558 back in the air and Concorde is significantly more complex, and required significant support from industry to keep it in the air, which is what made it uneconomical in the end. My SWAG would be £15m, which seems well beyond the credible. As for flying at the next Olympics, even if the money was available right now, it would take until then to get everyone necessary under contract, let alone start planning condition assessment.

To find out more about AF's Sierra Delta see here (http://www.olympus593.com/) and for BA's Alpha Foxtrot see here (http://www.saveconcordegroup.co.uk/). The remainder can be located via this link (http://www.concordesst.com/)

S

Adrian74 · Post by **Adrian74** » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:27 am

Stuart Baker wrote:
It took around £8m to put XH558 back in the air and Concorde is significantly more complex, and required significant support from industry to keep it in the air, which is what made it uneconomical in the end. My SWAG would be £15m, which seems well beyond the credible. As for flying at the next Olympics, even if the money was available right now, it would take until then to get everyone necessary under contract, let alone start planning condition assessment.

S

Totally agree Stuart. I for one would love to see Concorde back in the air, but to support the complex (and antiquated) systems to the satisfaction of the CAA would be impractical.

Yes we are going backwards. With Concorde, the Shuttle, and even going back to the great Cunard Liners pre-war, there was one common factor, and that is political will. If the politicians are not interested then great leaps forward in design and engineering will not occur. I fear therefore that we may be in store for gradual improvements from now on as we live in a de-risk society where big prestige engineering projects are deemed politically dangerous.

The furore over the Queen Elizabeth class carriers is a classic example of where public perception and political short termism have conspired to very nearly kill a project off. They would have been cancelled but the cancellation fees for the numerous sub-contractors would have made cancellation as expensive, if not more expensive than the completed ships. You continuously hear of the financial burden but out of it you will have two superb warships (and yes we do need them) which will be able to give potential aggressors what for. The cost, around £10 billion. Compare that to the cost to us all of the bank bailout. We will have the carriers for 30 years or longer which I think makes them reasonable value.

Rant over....

quicksilver-wsr · Post by **quicksilver-wsr** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:57 pm

Spaceflight buffs are being a little bit spoiled at the moment with TV docos, with the Shuttle programme having just drawn to a close.

Around the World in 60 Minutes is on BBC2 at 7pm this evening, then Space Shuttle: the Final Mission is on at 9pm, immediately after Top Gear.

The Bluebird Project

Space, The Final Frontier

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era

Re: The End Of An Era